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Topic: In The Long Run...
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Started by: davidtanny
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d Thanks for the clarification. It wasn't my intention to make it sound like he deliberately gave the genré his own name, but I can see now how what I said could be interpreted that way.
--- devospice
> Dr. Demento didn't start Dementia (as a genré), he just put it into
> the mainstream and gave it a (his own) name....
For the record it was Luke Ski who suggested and really pushed the renaming of the genre to dementia. Previously it was always known as novelty or simply comedy music.
His gripe with novelty was that the word implies silly little things that are only amusing for short periods, not well crafted music that stands up to repeat listens.
->Later.....Spice
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d > Dr. Demento didn't start Dementia (as a genré), he just put it into
> the mainstream and gave it a (his own) name....
For the record it was Luke Ski who suggested and really pushed the renaming of the genre to dementia. Previously it was always known as novelty or simply comedy music.
His gripe with novelty was that the word implies silly little things that are only amusing for short periods, not well crafted music that stands up to repeat listens.
->Later.....Spice
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d A lot has been said on this topic, and I suppose it will continue until the Doctor retires.
The post from Jmanforever intrigued me, because the letter from Talonian said that "The Dr. Demento Show has NEVER been off the air". Although that is true in the big picture, it is completely false in most of the local markets.
It was that reality that brought me and many other Mad Music Archive members here in the first place.... We wanted that piece of Demento that we have been denied since it went off the air locally.
Of course, I realize now that The Doctor Demento Show is actually nothing more than a brand name type package. We seek out Demento because that's the brand we know... but in the process, we discover The Mad Music Show and others..... and we find them to be just as good or even better.... and certainly less trouble to find.
I have nothing against Dr. Demento.... I wish him well. I agree with Spaff, but at the same time disagree. Dr. Demento didn't start Dementia (as a genré), he just put it into the mainstream and gave it a (his own) name.... But he did make it what it is today. (I won't go into playlist statistics regarding what artists he plays, because I have not personally been keeping track.)
Common playground practice is to put others down to make ourselves look good. I hope that's not where we are heading. I would rather see a serious attempt at creating the best demented programming rather than pointing fingers at the one who still remains on top.
Dr. Demento still has the edge in one respect.... He's making money from it. Most of his competition (probably not all) is still doing it as a labour of love. A good business plan along with a progressive step toward widespread radio airplay (with advertising revenue) will play a big role in putting somebody else on top in the dementia universe... and build a new "name brand" that people will immediately recognise.
Doctor Demento, of course, will always retain his place in history as the man who made this genré what it is today.
BTW.... The podcasts here and songs on The Fump are good enough for me, but if Doctor Demento was once again made available in my area, I might find time to listen once in a while.
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d I'm surprised that ANY radio stations still carry Dr. D. There is just no profit in it. Most stations require at least 10 to 12 minutes of advertisement time an hour to make money with a syndicated program. The Dr. only allows for 6 minutes. Before someone replies with "but there is 12 to 16 minutes of spots every hour.." keep in mind that most of those are NATIONAL spots, included with the show, that are making money for Talonian, but not for the station. Also, if you are not a top-rated station in a big market, you have to PAY to even air the show. It was $600 per year as of 2005. I haven't contacted them since. The station I work for decided to carry TMMS instead.
For those who are interested, here is what I got from the Talonian representative: (I edited out his personal info)
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Thank you for your interest in the DR.DEMENTO SHOW.
On our website, we receive thousands of email queries from people all over
the country who continually ask us: "Where can we hear The Dr. Demento Show
on the radio?" Listeners everywhere are familiar with the show due to its
long history of ratings success with a wide variety of age groups.
Today's Dr. Demento Show is a potent tool for raising station awareness.
It's a proven winner for classic rock and oldies stations. With its
constant genre-busting musical surprises, the show is a natural for newly
popular "variety" formats.
Whatever your format, the Dr. Demento Show can get people excited about
your station. Every week the Dr. Demento Show presents unique and hilarious
songs and comedy bits listeners can't stand to miss out on.
The Dr. Demento Show is the perfect antidote to the sort of bland,
predictable radio that has caused millions of listeners to lose interest.
This is the way to get people really excited about weekends on your station!
****
The Dr. Demento Show, a two-hour weekly feature, is available on a
market-exclusive barter basis to Arbitron rated commercial broadcast
stations, FM or AM. The show is timed to allow for six minutes of local
spots per hour.
Non-Arbitron-rated and non-commercial broadcast stations can obtain the
show for $150.00 per quarter, to cover the costs of duplicating and
shipping. (We are not making the show available to Internet-only stations
at this time).
Though we recommend weekend air times (especially Sunday evening), the show
can be run anytime between 6 AM and midnight, any day of the week.
Our contract is for a one year period with automatic renewable options.
Let us know what your broadcasting market is, along with your signal
strength and quarter-hour ratings, and we'll let you know right away about
the availability of the show.
We are very proud to say that the Dr. Demento Show has developed a legion
of fans over the past 36 years who will listen without fail to the show
each and every week! Stations currently airing the Dr. Demento Show state
that it is one of their basic, dependable staples. In its total history,
The Dr. Demento Show has NEVER been off the air, indicating its continuing
popularity.
Please contact me at the number listed below for more info.
Again, thank you for your inquiry. Now, hang on to your hat - and welcome
to the wonderful world of Mad Music and Crazy Comedy!
Arthur Chadbourne
The Dr. Demento Show
Talonian Productions
CELL - 562-***-****
Fax 562 ***-****
******@mindspring.com
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d Ever since Wayne ran afoul of Mr. Hansen's incorporated self, Talonian, and TMMS was created, we've discussed at length what the hell Dr. D. was thinking. You need only type 'talonian' into the search engine to read the whole thing. Everyone had their own take on it. I thought he was trying to get a bit of cash together to retire with. He was 65 and it was only a matter of time. The general consensus was that whatever his motivation, he was doing badly by his internet fans who couldn't hear his show otherwise and was creating lots of bad will toward himself that wasn't there before, destroying his future marketability in the process.
To fill the void created by Talonian's eliminating the show on the net, the demand for 'mad music' closed the hole itself. TMMS, The FuMP, Dementia Radio, David Tanny, The Kahn Man and everyone else who bring it all to us did what Demento refused to in order to make the hard sell and net a few paltry bucks for his retirement fund.
In the '70s, Mr. Hansen brought me 'madness' that made me forget about the real thing for a while- Vietnam, Watergate, the so-called 'energy crisis', swine flu (look it up), and all the other crap that was going on. Oh yeah, that and the prospect of immediate nuclear annihilation at any moment. Gotta be thankful.
But clearly, as age took hold and the 'retirement monster' approached, his priorities changed and amassing cash for the coming years- more reality, less 'madness'- (I can relate) became the thing. Don't be too pissed. It happens to us all... Barry's needs and seeming indifference to his fanbase have just made it happen sooner rather than later. This site and others like it have emerged to fill the void. I have the nasty feeling that unless Dr. D. changes his tight-fisted anti-net policy, that whether it was planned or not, there may be a new Dr. (or Cap'n) of Dementia before too long. Now's the time to prepare to put a broadside into the ass of the mundane. ARRRR!
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d I have no idea what Talonian's business objectives are, so I don't know whether they're being reached or not. It's quite literally not my business.
I completely disagree, however, with the argument that Dr. Demento doesn't play enough material from new/unusual performers. That's what he DOES. Pull up any one of his playlists and tell me how many of those performers ever get played outside of dementiaville.
No, Dr. Demento doesn't play everything that gets sent to him. That would be impossible. Technology has paved the way for anyone to record songs who has the inclination to do so. And many many MANY people have the inclination to do so. Two hours once a week isn't enough time to even scratch the surface.
Personal experience: I remember the first time Dr. Demento played a Robert Lund song. (Shoot, I *should* remember - it was less than three years ago.) I was thrilled, I felt legitimized as a lyricist, and it inspired me to keep writing. I now send Dr. Demento almost everything I write that Robert Lund (or anyone else) records. Does he play every song I send him? Hell no. But when he does play a song, I'm thrilled all over again. I'm glad he took a chance (and continues to take chances) on our music. So no one can tell *me* that Dr. D. doesn't expose new stuff.
I'm very glad that so many new avenues are opening up for people to discover and play new music. I'm glad that dementia has such a passionate following and that devotees (David Tanny and Captain Wayne, to name just two) produce shows that feed our sick cravings and even expose material that Dr. Demento doesn't get to. But I see no need whatsoever to insult Dr. D.
You may (and obviously do) disagree with his business model, and you can (and obviously do) question it, but there's no need to attack him. Dementia is his genre. He started it. It's named after him. Give him the credit he deserves.
Viva El Doctor!
xoxox
Spaff
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d Early this year, I read a discussion here mentioning rumors about Dr. Demento retiring. Looking at his situation over the last six months, I'm surprised he didn't retire in the first place.
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d As a radio broadcaster, I agree fully with your comments, particularly about the very narrow playlists by commercial radio stations, most of whom would not know talent if it bit them on the proverbial.
Although based in Australia, I have been broadcasting the Mad Music Show for some time, and receive positive comments about the show.
I would like more stations to pick up any one of the podcasts that you listed, just to keep the dementia alive.
I, on a personal basis, am open to promote more artists on our own comedy show broadcasts.
Our radio station here in Australia, has been in contact with a new community based station in the UK, The Eye, in the hamlet of Melton-Mowbray.
We sent some cd's or our various programs including the comedy show featuring highlights of TMMS, they were delighted and are going to discuss taking the show or something like it.
The Eye
As a point of interest, I am also broadcasting a program called, The Woodsongs Old Time Radio Hour.
This started as a small podcast out of Kentucky, by folk singer Michael Jonathan.
Over time, it grew to be broacast on over 450 radio stations world wide, looking forward to the day when Manic Monday, TMMS, David Tanney and the others can boast the same.
Alex.
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d You're right. You're so right.
Eventually Dr. Demento is going to have absolutely no audience, and it's no one's fault but his own. He's shutting himself off from the mainstream completely.
I sent him a copy of my album, "Jumping the Shark with Style" last year. He didn't play a single song off it (unless you count his one-minute edit of "I Cannot Sing" that he played when I sent him a CD with just that song). And unlike a lot of people, I didn't even get a letter from him explaining why he wouldn't play it.
I'm just hoping that a show like The Mad Music Show will eventually pick up and become the new Dr. Demento so that dementia will have SOME kind of mainstream outlet. My music tends to do pretty well on the Internet radio shows, and I thank David Tanny, Captain Wayne, Jake Waters, Kahn Man, Tom Rockwell, and every other Internet broadcaster that's played a Nuclear Bubble Wrap song.
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fjrigjwwe9r2threads:MessageText fiogf49gjkf0d Dr. Demento will be without an audience as long as Talonian and Dr.
Demento keep up with what they're doing.
No internet streaming from the affilliates not only hurts the show's
coverage, it hurts the artists trying to get exposure to the mainstream
audience, as well as providing no incentive for a radio station to carry
such as radio show. They might as well produce their own funny music
shows.
Also hurting Dr. Demento is the lack of play of many innovative novelty
comedy and dementia artists I have been witnessing. I heard many of
them on www.dementiaradio.org, www.themadmusicarchive.com,
www.thefump.com, www.davidtanny.com (yes, there are now
demented song downloads of mine now), www.myspace.com/,
www.soundclick.com/, submissions for the now-defunct dfsx radio
stream, the late Friggin' Here show, and other places.
If Dr. Demento keeps on ignoring such dementia or other interesting
weird stuff, fewer and fewer people are going to be reccomending
to others to send in their funny stuff since Dr. Demento doesn't seem
to know dementia when he hears it. As a result, fewer people will be
caring whether Dr. Demento is carried on their local station or not, and
they'll be surfing elsewhere for easy access to dementia,
When more people know that they can get demented without going through
a gatekeeper like Talonian where they have to pay $2 for a s***ty
quality service to be blunt, it's Dr. Demento that will be penalized the
most for shooting itself in the foot like it's been doing for years.
In turn, fewer people will be renewing their expensive subscriptions to
The Demento Society, care what he has played on his show whether they
listen to it or not, sending in their songs to Dr. Demento for him NOT
to play, They're going to be uploading their own songs, sending them to
Captain Wayne, Me, dementiaradio.org, and others, telling their friends
to tune in to those shows and send in their stuff, telling some radio
stations to pick up Captain Wayne's Mad Music Show and possiblilty
The Mad Music Dementia Top 20 Show, and the ball just keeps on rolling.
Dr. Demento is less open about the new kinds of dementia that's out
there, insists on favoring new music from the same seven novelty song artists
again and again, hardly gives the newcomers any exposure, just like
corporate radio's tight playlist engineers do. People who aren't getting
exposure will be getting it in many other places anyway since their
music won't be streamed for free on Dr. Demento's affilliates where
people won't hear the songs being played.
Or are there really fewer people submitting their stuff to Dr. Demento
than there were last year?
Or maybe Dr. Demento just doesn't surf the Internet.
More people are no longer making appointments with the Doctor. Instead,
they're taking a cruise with The Captain and other hosts.
I've privately heard from some artists that I'm not going to disclose
that the songs I've been giving exposure on my DT20 Countdown and DFSX
were the ones that were rejected by Dr. Demento. I even featured a few
ISGD shows in the past featuring songs Dr. Demento refused to play and
they were anything but rejects, in fact, pretty decent dementia suitable
for airplay.
Something's wrong with Dr. Demento. I guess he's suffering from
dementia, unable to judge dementia when he hears it. He might already be
demented in a sad sense that he can't tell dementia from non-dementia.
I'm witnessing firsthand how good service can grow a business and how
bad service can kill a business. In my case, giving people exposure not
only helps the artists, they also give my show a reccomendation and a
plug when they're performing to an audience in a small clubhouse or
venue. I give them a play, they give me free publicity in return. Other
artists get the hint and in turn start sending in stuff for me to play.
And the cycle goes on. That's a good business model.
A bad business model is turning away your potential free publicity by
ignoring their works, some of which may fit the scope of dementia.
Most of the artists are happy if 2-3 of their songs on a CD make the
show and don't expect to get every song from an album featured. I did
just that this weekend when I spun 30 to 45 second excerpts of all of
Steve Goodie's tracks off of his album "Welcome To Stupid Country" to
generate some buzz and to get people motivated to go to
www.stevegoodie.com and buy his albums there. I plan to play a
few full-versions of his songs when they make the Top 10 portion. I'm
not going to give it all away. If only one song from the album fits,
than that is fine, it's enough to get a plug for their work in and for
me to hear from them again. Some songs work, but some don't, but that's
the risk we're willing to take. The song was successful in getting
feedback is what's important though the song might have bombed.
Some other songs that are non-demented also get played, especially those
that interest me but get ignored by commercial radio. I like to play
some rap that is suitable for hearing, some rock and roll, some new
wave, some country, some electronica, and maybe whatever else could
generate some interest. I like to surprise my listeners with stuff
commercial radio ignores. My listeners don't care that much for folk
or polka unless it's funny.
To conclude, in the long run, we'll be staying demented in a musical
sense, but with hosts other than Dr. Demento.
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